Leaders say House will simplify Beshear's casino amendment

FRANKFORT -- Democratic lawmakers in the House will dramatically simplify Gov. Steve Beshear's proposed constitutional amendment to allow 12 casinos in Kentucky, House Speaker Jody Richards said Friday.

A revised amendment may lower the number of casinos allowed in the state and would likely omit a specific tax rate on casino wagers and details about how the state would spend those proceeds, said Richards, D-Bowling Green.

The proposal might continue to include broad spending categories, such as education, but not a specific percentage breakdown of where the money should go, as Beshear proposed.

The House will put a priority on passing the constitutional amendment instead of the enabling legislation Beshear proposed that identified where five free-standing casinos would be built, Richards said after meeting with fellow House Democratic leaders in his Capitol office.

“All of us agree that the constitutional amendment should be simplified with fewer specifics,” Richards said. “The enabling legislation is going to be far more difficult. There are a lot of issues in there."

Enabling legislation is “divisive, it makes the problem harder,” Richards said.

Beshear has proposed seven casinos to be operated by horse racing tracks and up to five others in Daviess County, Kenton or Campbell counties, Boyd or Greenup counties, Christian County and Laurel or Whitley counties.

Richards said a House subcommittee that has been studying casino gambling will make recommendations on the rewriting of Beshear’s constitutional amendment to the Licensing and Occupations Committee and the Elections and Constitutional Amendments Committee.

“We would like to get it out of the House within the next 10 days,” he said.

The House subcommittee will review Beshear's proposed amendment at 1 p.m. on Tuesday, said co-chair Joni Jenkins, D-Shively. The group will review the amendment's companion legislation on Wednesday and Thursday, Jenkins said.

Asked if voters would be more reluctant to vote for an amendment that does not contain specifics on spending, Richards said, “My problem right now is to get 60 votes in the House for a constitutional amendment. That’s what I’m going to try to do.  I don’t know what that does to it on the ballot.”

Kentucky voters would decide the issue at the polls in November if the legislature approves the constitutional amendment. 

Two-thirds of members in both the 100-member House and 38-member Senate must approve the measure before it can get on the November ballot. Senate President David Williams, R-Burkesville, has said the proposal stands no chance in his chamber.

Beshear this week said he provided specifics in his amendment because of concerns that arose in the late 1980s after the legislature and voters approved a generally-worded amendment to set up a statewide lottery. It raised questions on how money from the lottery was being spent.

Sen. David Boswell, an Owensboro Democrat who has been proposing legislation for years to allow casino gambling in Kentucky, said the wording of Beshear’s proposed constitutional amendment is “too wordy” and “should not contain specific percentages on how the money should be spent.”

He said the amendment should contain general information on the spending of tax proceeds from casinos, “but you don’t want to lock yourself in too much.”

Voters tend to skip over amendments on the ballot that are long, Boswell said. Beshear's proposed ballot question is 93 words long and doesn't mention casinos until the 43rd word.

- Jack Brammer

Comments

[Bobby Sherman]

The number of votes required to propose a constitutional amendment is 3/5 of each chamber...60 votes in the House; 23 votes in the Senate.

[Kelsey]

I was told today by high members of the house that they have the 60 votes needed and will make some changes in the bill and send it on its way to the Senate in less than 2 weeks. FAST TRACK this bill people so Ky can get out of debt. Governor Carroll says he has 20-22 votes in the state Senate and should be able to get a few more in several weeks. This is a great day for Ky, money for the mandates, that is what we all need.
Go Obama.
Kelsey.

[Truth]

Kelsey, I think everybody that comes onto this site can tell how ridiculous you are. Don't even try!!

[Beshear is clever with his wording]

Beshear sure took care of the Horsey folks in his Amendment. Check out how much money the horsey people get BACK from all those racinos.

Section 36
Each racing association gaming licensee shall set aside the amounts provided in this section from adjusted gaming receipts received from casino gaming on a weekly basis and shall, on or before the third business day of the following week, allocate, expend, distribute, and pay these amounts in accordance with the provisions of this section.

* 1%) of adjusted gaming receipts shall be paid to the Kentucky Equine Breed Authority established by Section 39

* (0.15%) of adjusted gaming receipts shall be paid to the Kentucky Quarter Horse Purse Program established by KRS 230.3771(4).

*A racing association gaming licensee that conducts thoroughbred racing shall allocate and distribute fourteen and one-half percent (14.5%) of adjusted gaming receipts as follows:

* (81.33%) of the funds shall be paid for the increase of purses and purse supplements for thoroughbred races as follows

* Kentucky Thoroughbred Development Fund Advisory Committee established by KRS 230.400, shall determine a percentage of these funds, not less than ten percent (10%) nor greater than twenty percent (20%), to be paid as Kentucky thoroughbred claiming fund purse supplements at race meetings conducted by the racing association gaming licensee, and the racing association gaming licensee shall allocate and pay this percentage to these purse supplements; and
* 18%) of the funds shall be paid by the racing association gaming licensee to the Kentucky thoroughbred breeders incentive fund established by KRS 230.800; and
0.67%) shall be paid by the racing association gaming licensee as follows:
1. (50%) to the Kentucky Division of the Horsemen's Benevolent and Protective Association, or its successor; and
2. (50%) to the Kentucky Thoroughbred Owners and Breeders Association, or its successor.

--- How much does the casino/horse track give to education, healthcare?

[more of section 36 to the horsey folks]

Section 36
(4) A racing association gaming licensee conducting standardbred racing shall allocate and distribute fourteen and one-half percent (14.5%) of adjusted gaming receipts as follows:
(a) Seventeen and one-half percent (17.5%) shall be paid to the Kentucky standardbred breeders incentive fund established by KRS 230.802;
(b) Two and one-half percent (2.5%) shall be paid to a subaccount of the purse fund of the gaming licensee to be used to supplement standardbred races at county fair programs in Kentucky;
(c) Sixty-seven hundredths of one percent (0.67%) shall be paid to the Kentucky Harness Horsemen's Association, or its successor; and
(d) 1. The remaining funds shall be placed in the racing association gaming licensee's purse fund to be used exclusively to supplement purse money paid at race meetings conducted by the racing association gaming licensee.
2. However, unless otherwise provided in an agreement, if the funds to be applied to purses exceed an average of one hundred thousand dollars ($100,000) per day of live racing, then the racing association gaming licensee shall, subject to the approval of the Kentucky Harness Horsemen's Association:

[something smells like horse crap]

So ... .under Beshear's Amendment, the horsey people pay taxes BUT get those taxes back but split them up with the purse, breeders incentive, etc.

When a law firm pays taxes, do they get that money back.

When a car dealer pays taxes, do they get that money back?

When a restaurant pay taxes, do they get their tax money back?

Why should the horsey folks get their money back?

Clever old man that Beshear.

We all know that once this thing passes, the legislators will have fun jacking up the amount the horse industry gets. Just last year, the legistors wanted an Amendment that gave the horse industry 64%.

Is Beshear's Amendment just something to get casinos in the door so they can take money out of education later? I think so. I don't trust these people.

I say, if ALL the money does not go toward education & healthcare ... screw the Amendment.

[We have a shady governor]

You gotta know, even if it were to be written that all the money goes to Education and Healthcare, it can and will be changed.

[Glenn]

David Williams has started early tring to scare the house into not sending the senate a passed casino admendment. Why so early you say?

Because one of the free standing ones would be in Whitley County, which is one of the king's counties. There are a lot of big-money republicans that want this and they will put a lot of heat on williams to do it.

[Kelsey]

ALSO there was an article in todays WSJ that the counties where Casinos are located have less than 50% of the home forclosure rate as counties in states with no casinos. They also have LESS, yes LESS crime than the city without casinos because they can affort to hire the people to infoce the laws. Call you state Representative and demand that they vote and support the Casino Bill Today.
Go Obama.
Kelsey.

[consicence]

Kelsey, judging from your spelling, we better up the education percentages

[consicence]

Kelsey, How about some citations for your facts from a reputable source?....your imagination does not count

[Kelsey]

I know, consicence post above 7:29+7:30,that you are a Ky Redneck, I can tell by the way you attack people on this blog. There are also others who attack me on this blog that wont give there real name, they are also Rednecks. Your mothers must have ran the bars during school nights when you were young because you did not learn to respect other people. As for the facts, the WSJ which again you dont know what that means because you are ignorant. So go judge someone else.
Go Obama.
Kelsey.

[Kelsey is a fruitcake!]

Shut up, Kelsey! No one wants to hear your garbage!

[Riddle me this Kelsey]

Kelsey, if casinos are so great, why doesn't Greg Scumbo want one in his home county?

[Not such a fool!]

Stumbo is doing nothing but trying to manipulate us. He is trying to sound like he is kind of with us and not too sure about this, then watch him change his mind. Part of their plan they made "Behind those closed doors, that nobody but Beshear and Friends were allowed into!"

[Nevada HIGHEST foreclosure rate]

Kelsey, You are wrong. Nevada is the casino capital of the world. If casinos are so great for the "people" then no one would expect Nevada to have the HIGHEST foreclosure rate in the country ... But they do.

From money magazine Jan. 29,2008

"Nevada had the highest foreclosure rate in the nation last year, with 3.4 percent of its households receiving foreclosure filings. That was more than three times the national average, RealtyTrac said.

The state had 66,316 filings on 34,417 properties in 2007, up more than 200 percent from 2006's total."

End quote:
Link:
http://money.aol.com/news/articles/_a/nevada-had-top-foreclosure-rate-in-2007/n20080129053709990027

[coleman]

Mississippi Governor Haley Barbour, a Republican, has endorsed the casinos in his state and you should see how Mississippi is prospering. It is the hyprocrites like Forgy and Williams who oppose casinos in our states. However Williams goes to casinos and I have seen Larry Forgy's girfriend in casinos in the past.

[alex]

Coleman if you are so smart just who is Forgys girlfriend that you have seen at the casinos?

[IMO]

Kelsey, once again with the falsehoods? If you make a statement relevant to fact, back it up with evidence that is provable,not because "Kelsey says so". There have been hundreds of posts on these blogs, substantiated by independent sources of information that have totally contradicted any of the garbage you have posted. Whenever someone challenges you for the truth (Mr. Stivers) you resort to name calling and spewing more lies to attempt to build your case. I can honestly say, I have always been a pro life supporter but after constantly seeing your lies, misstatements and flat out falsehoods, I would have made an exception of recommending abortion to your parents.

[Kelsey]

TO FORGY-HACK-STIVERS-KEMPER,I saw David Williams at the boat and he was yelling numbers over the craps table as loud as anyone. A man that has Liquor stores in Lexington told me once that drive-in-windows were made so the baptist could get them a drink also. Same way with those Casinos, when the time comes they will race to the polls to vote it in, then go to there churchs and yell they are against Casinos.
LET THE PEOPLE VOTE.
Go Obama.
Kelsey.

[Let the people Vote]

KELSEY IS CORRECT 100%

[Elizabeth]

There is going to be so much in this that will be interesting to watch. Governor Jones' comment in today's paper is very telling. Unless the amendment 1) specifies the amount going to horsemen, now at 15.65% and 2) specifies the number and location of free-standing casinos, the horse people will probably oppose it.

Read that again.

All this divisiveness we've put up with was because of KEEP's, with Jones at its head, pushing of its own agenda. For years there was a strong debate among breeders whether casinos in Kentucky would help or hurt racing. The "help" side won out. But they have to be careful. If they don't get a high-enough cut, or if there are too many casinos, or if they are located too near the ones linked to tracks, then that could turn their desired profit into loss.

They also know there could easily be a backlash. Their counsel/lobbyest, who is now our governor, has just taken a big drop in job approval.

It is interesting.

[Kelsey]

Elizabeth, you lay off B Jones. He is my close personal friend. He has worked his heart out to get this bill going and get Steve Beshear elected Governor. He has helped raise thousands of dollars for KEEP and the Election of our Governor. He deserves to be protected in this bill. He has worked close with Governor Beshear "another of my close personal friends"to have the proper wording in place.
So go pick on someone else.
Go Obama.
Kelsey

[Elizabeth]

You are hysterical, Kelsey.

I really like Governor Jones. He did, in my opinion, alot for the state. He was the only Dem governor since Breathitt (who my daddy thought was excellant) not tainted by scandal. I liked how he tried to get better health care for children and how he faced down the right-wingers over KERA.

I have no doubt that he also believes that casino gambling taxes would be good for the state if it was guarannteed that they were allocated to education and health. And he would want a guaranntee that horsemen get a high-enough percentage. Not having that in the amendment means that subsequent legislators or governors could change the numbers.

But horse interests walk a fine line here. They will be getting nervous if they feel that the tipping point goes too far and casinos could end up hurting racing.

And some of the classier breeder/owners might not like the association with casino intersts who have bad reputations in other states.

[The Anti-Kelsey]

Kelsey, Eastern State Hospital called. You missed bed check!

[curious]

AAH HAA KELSEY - I've figured you out. Very funny - Keep up the good work. You're getting the responses you're asking for.

[afraid of this administration]

AAH HA Kelsey- I've figured you out. Very funny. Keep up the good work - you're getting the responses you're asking for.

[Jimmy]

It's ok to talk about the casino amendment but someone ought to look at HB 361 which allows cities and counties,by referendum, to raise sales taxes, exise taxes, levys with an argument by League of Cities that there must be another referendum to approve. I think anyone with any intelligence can see thru this as it is another way of taxing the people of Kentucky by using the high price lawfirms of Kentucky to convolute the issue. The way i read it is that this is a general amendment to the constitution of kentucky and must be be submitted to a vote of the people, just like any other constitutional amendment . Once the constitution is amended then it is up to the general assembly by virtue of "general laws" to allow local governments to put on local ballots levys an additional taxes. Better keep your eyes on this one.

[Jimmy Krack Korn]

Not sure this matters... wouldn't it be refreshing if Sens Williams and Kelly had some promise of an alternative remedy to the state's problems instead of the typically firm guarantee of obstruction. They are clearly in the election business, not representative gummint

[Philip]

Jimmy: It is the governor's responsibility to propose a budget. Beshear promised a plan B. Where is it?! Williams cannot do Beshear's job for him, although I am sure he could do it better. Then again, who couldn't?! All Beshear offers us is FOOL'S GOLD!

[beaverbear]

Kilsey, your 4:52 PM posting on Feb. 15th about Sen. Juliam Carroll telling you he had 20-22 votes for expanded casino gambling, and would soon have more is not true. It was reported last weekend in the FRANKFORT STATE-JOURNAl that Sen. Carroll has not yet made up his mind on the issue. When Senate President David Williams (last week) asked those senators who favored expanded gambling to stand up, only three stood up and Sen. Carroll was not one of them Anyone who wants to know the truth about where Sen. Carroll stands on the issue and what he told Kilsey (if anything, my guess he does not even know Kilsey) can call Sen. Carroll and find out the truth for yourself (502-695-4459 at his home, 502-564-8100 at the Capitol Annex or 502-223-8806 at his office). These phone numbers are public information.

[Jim Anderson Stivers]

Way to go beaverbear.

I can tell you that Senator Carroll did not acknowledge knowing Kelsey. He did not say he didn't know this man, he just didn't answer the question, however, I have sent an email just to ask again. Especially, since Kelsey has made the statement Senator Carroll knows of at least twenty, that will favor the amendment.

Jim Anderson Stivers

[Jim Anderson Stivers]

Elizabeth,

You are correct.

But horse interests walk a fine line here. They will be getting nervous if they feel that the tipping point goes too far and casinos could end up hurting racing.

And some of the classier breeder/owners might not like the association with casino interests who have bad reputations in other states.

Reports I read say: When Casino Gambling comes to a geography, betting on horses goes down. But, if Keenland gets slots, that will offset the lack of participation of betting on horses. And you can bet if the Casino Issue does pass, KEENLAND and CHURCHILL will not allow CASINOS ON THEIR PROPERTY.

They understand the socio\economic demographics, between those that play the ponies, and those that wear their arm out pulling the lever on a slot machine.

Incidently, I read . . . Each day the USA gambling establishments take in ONE BILLION DOLLARS PER DAY from SLOTS MACINES.

The most addictive form of Gambling.

Jim Anderson Stivers.

[Kelsey]

First my name is Kelsey, not Kilsey. I am not afraid of giving my name which I am proud of. Sen Carroll knew my dad very well, because he gave him lots of MONEY and he knows me very well but will not talk about his good doners. And Sen. Carroll will tell you that at his fundraiser at the Red Mile about two months ago, he stated that he 100% supports Casinos, and my close personal friend, Joe Casta, from New Jersey who owns the Red Mile held the fund raiser for Sen. Carroll who is a hugh member of KEEP. Now go figure. And Mr Stivers the Spinner, Gov Carroll just told me on the phone that he said Sunday in the State Journal that he would be against all Casinos in the U.S., but is a realist and knows we need to the money for unfunded mandates, but that 12 will not make it out of the house. If we get it thru the house, we have the votes in the Senate, but Williams does not know that yet. So Mr Stivers if you were a smart man, you would let the people vote.
Go Obama.
Kelsey.

[Jim Anderson Stivers]

RESEARCH REPORT NO 316 BY THE KENTUCKY LRC.

This is a lift from a resolution from our own General Assembly. It seems the problem of compulsive gambling was a concern for the General Assembly so they ask the LRC to get scientific information for them.

PROJECT STAFF
Barry Boardman, Ph.D.
Jack Jones
John Perry
Murray Wood
Research Report No. 316
Legislative Research Commission
Frankfort, Kentucky
November 2003

I AM SURE THIS SURVEY WAS NOT FREE AND COST THE LRC SOME TIME AND MONEY TO OBTAIN SOME ANSWERS TO THE QUSTION RAISED BY OUR OWN GENERAL ASSEMLBY IN 2003.

HOW AN ANY MEMBER OF THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, THAT READ THIS REPORT, NOT UNDERSTAND THE SOCIAL AND FAMILY COST OF COMPULSIVE GAMBLING.

AND NOW, JUST A FEW YEARS LATER, THE KEEP LOBBY HAS FOUND A WAY TO GET THE ISSUE TO THE BALLOT, IF IT WILL PASS THE AMENDEMENT STRUCTURE. WHY IS IT, THE GOVERNMENT PAYS FOR SUCH WORK, AND NEVER READS IT OR INTERPRETS THE DANGERS?

THIS SURVEY WAS LIKELY CONDUCTED AS A TOOL FOR THE HORSE LOBBY, THAT IS, UNTIL THE RESULTS PROVED TO BE CONTRARY TO THEIR DESIRED RESULTS. Imo. JAS

The Compulsive Gambling Population in Kentucky
A statewide survey was developed to provide insight into gambling in Kentucky. The
survey results provide information on the types of gambling taking place in Kentucky and to what extent there is problem and compulsive gambling behavior among the adult
population of Kentucky.

Based on the survey it is estimated that 55 percent of adult Kentuckians engaged in some form of gambling in the past year. Of those who gambled, it is estimated that 12.3 percent may have had some problem with their gambling. An affirmative answer to at least one of the 10 criteria used to determine the degree of problem and compulsive gambling would indicate a gambler who may be at risk of developing serious gambling problems.

Nearly1 percent of past year gamblers, and 0.5 percent of all adult Kentuckians, exhibited compulsive gambling behavior in the past year based on these 10 criteria.
The 10 criteria used to evaluate at-risk, problem, and compulsive gambling come from
the American Psychiatric Associations’

Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of the Mental Disorders

(DSM-IV). The DSM-IV criteria is intended to establish a diagnosis for pathological (compulsive) gambling in a clinical setting and as such often produces conservative estimates when used in a survey setting. Therefore, those who meet at least five of the 10 criteria are referred to as probable compulsive gamblers since they are not being diagnosed in a clinical environment. Those meeting three or four of the criteria are considered exhibiting problem gambling behavior. If one or two of the criteria are met, then the gambler is considered at risk of developing problem and compulsive gambling behavior.

In Kentucky, it is estimated that there were 20,000 problem and 15,000 probable
compulsive gamblers over the past year. An additional 170,000 adults may be considered at risk of developing some problems with their gambling. Of all past-year gamblers, an estimated 24,000 sought treatment for their gambling problems.
Because of the method required to gain statewide information on gamblers, it is suspected that the prevalence of problem gambling is underreported and represents a lower-bound Legislative Research Commission Executive Summary.

“I just wanna say!”

Jim Anderson Stivers
Frankfort, KY.

[Jim Anderson Stivers]

Take a look at this! Is Worley trying to find a back door for slot machines? If not then why would he ask for an AG opinion that is already in the AG files?

HMMMMM A blogger sent me this:

A few weeks ago someone raised the question of a back door for gambling. The report indicated our Governor could pass a slot machine bill, without approval of the voters.

Here is what the Attorney General reports:

Hat tip, to S.

AG says,
"Hence, "lotteries" are constitutionally distinct from other forms of gambling.")

"Here's the opinion of Assistant AG Robert S. Jones March 2005

"Opinion of the Attorney General

"Senator Ed Worley requests the Attorney General's opinion on the following questions:

1) Within the Constitution of Kentucky, are there limitations or prohibitions on the authority of the General Assembly to enact statutory language authorizing the expansion of gambling in Kentucky?

Answer: Qualified Yes. Ky. Const. Section 226(3) would prohibit the General Assembly from sanctioning a "lottery", defined as a species of gambling, and described as a scheme for the distribution of prizes
or things of value, purely by lot or by chance, among persons who have paid, or agree to pay, a valuable consideration, for the chance to share in the distribution, except as specifically authorized by Ky.
Const.

2) Further, does the Kentucky Constitution distinguish between the forms of expanded gambling to restrict the General Assembly in any specific area of such expansion?

Answer: Yes. The framers of the Constitution clearly rejected the inclusion of other forms of gaming within the prohibition of "lotteries", as defined above, when Ky. Const. Section 226 was passed. Hence, "lotteries" are constitutionally distinct from other forms of gambling."

[Jim Anderson Stivers]

Take a look at this! Is Worley trying to find a back door for slot machines? If not then why would he ask for an AG opinion that is already in the AG files?

HMMMMM A blogger sent me this:

A few weeks ago someone raised the question of a back door for gambling. The report indicated our Governor could pass a slot machine bill, without approval of the voters.

Here is what the Attorney General reports:

Hat tip, to S.

AG says,
"Hence, "lotteries" are constitutionally distinct from other forms of gambling.")

"Here's the opinion of Assistant AG Robert S. Jones March 2005

"Opinion of the Attorney General

"Senator Ed Worley requests the Attorney General's opinion on the following questions:

1) Within the Constitution of Kentucky, are there limitations or prohibitions on the authority of the General Assembly to enact statutory language authorizing the expansion of gambling in Kentucky?

Answer: Qualified Yes. Ky. Const. Section 226(3) would prohibit the General Assembly from sanctioning a "lottery", defined as a species of gambling, and described as a scheme for the distribution of prizes
or things of value, purely by lot or by chance, among persons who have paid, or agree to pay, a valuable consideration, for the chance to share in the distribution, except as specifically authorized by Ky.
Const.

2) Further, does the Kentucky Constitution distinguish between the forms of expanded gambling to restrict the General Assembly in any specific area of such expansion?

Answer: Yes. The framers of the Constitution clearly rejected the inclusion of other forms of gaming within the prohibition of "lotteries", as defined above, when Ky. Const. Section 226 was passed. Hence, "lotteries" are constitutionally distinct from other forms of gambling."